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List of forums -> Your suggestions and bug reports -> suggestion: remove all independent suppliers...

Suggestions on how to make our virtual business game better and reports about discovered errors.

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Topic created : 7.10.2016, 14:52
JustNash
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... and replace them with an independent supplier of game points. The price of these points should make it so that players can buy them and start mines, oil wells, ... and offer ores and oil at the same price the independent supplier currently does.
 
It's just a wild idea. Maybe it's really bad. Maybe it has some opportunities?   

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8.10.2016, 00:18
waerth
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Its already difficult enough to get affordable supplies. With that system the price of grain, sugar etc will rise to 309459049273522370404 dollars a piece. 
 

8.10.2016, 00:38

Last time edited : 8.10.2016, 23:57
Mike1
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are you maaaad? Not so
 
Edit:
Just imagine how long a new player would have to play for saving cash to buy a little 5 points mine of every basic type coal, iron, silica, oil. The price of virt would need to be really cheap, which will cannibalise the game's income.
 
PS: my company consumes daily  154 Million grain, 13 M oil, 7 M coal, 7 M iron, 6 M Silica ... 
 

8.10.2016, 16:40
gamerz300
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Yes/No
 
The main issue isn't removing the independent suppliers. The main issue is the game breaking costs of points...
 
Games I've played in the past with points for cash concepts always had a in-game item to keep the prices level.. For example:
 
Drift city has paid gotcha and free gotcha, along with free/paid items of the same thing (perm vs temp or different lengths). Points while playing went for 150k-500k depending on games economic standing of players.
 
Runescape brought in a similar system which brought in a economic standard to the game (I quite before this) and also basically killing bots and real world trading.
 
The point is I'm all for having the independent suppliers being removed, however a independent supplier of points has to have a price point for fairly new users (6 months) to use. This will literally piss everyone buying points right off lol... It will also annoy the devs...
 
But in all seriousness this games points are excessively overpriced... If I was able/willing(not, simply too lazy) to get Mike1 JustNash (or any of my friends with equal/better qualifications) along with a few of my dev/graphical friends we alone could likely create a web based game in less a year that costs less... Just putting that out there.
 
How to put it in a nice way... Oh I know To you
http://www.thehosthelpers.com/general-chat/looking-for-people-who-are-willing-to-help-with-my-current-project/msg18487/#msg18487
 I'm going to try to create something 100% live with out f*ck*ng the rat sh*t out of a server lol
Yes it's possible, hell before I quite Truckersmp (due to issues with one admin) I was working on live ai, goal was up to approx 2000 ai units updating simultaneously mixing with live users.
 
That project died with my free time (and the laptops screen lol)
 

 
I'm all for the suppliers being removed if done right. However based on past decisions of the team this is a game killer.
 
If it does happen bq1 only farms plantations mines for in-game money bought points (excluding user bought then sold points), this means a new points currency, a 1-1 point currency worth not a 10-1 just to try to promote buying them instead... Real world bought bq1 property give 15% product/production boost.
 
What will happen is players like me will buy a ton load and dump it on the market, likely causing a crash but it'll steady once all the hoarders go under. 
 

8.10.2016, 18:16

Last time edited : 8.10.2016, 18:17
Wonson
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gamers300
Games I've played in the past with points for cash concepts always had a in-game item to keep the prices level.

That's exactly what makes JN´ recent suggestions worth thinking. Anything that maintains some sort of  balance between primary and secondary game currency can be a desirable thing. In fact I liked his previous suggestion, tying independent supplier price to virt market value, more; unfortunately manipulating virt value is much too easy. 
IT'S JUST BUSINESS!
 

10.10.2016, 11:38

Last time edited : 10.10.2016, 11:43
JustNash
Twelve years with Virtonomics Jubilee Ten Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Macedonian common amphora Common amphora of Heraklion The winner in the nomination Your Way to success of the Industry Competition Winner of the Contest for Managers in the nomination "Knowledge is power!"
One year with Virtonomics
Основатель г.Хасселт Jewelry Loupe Founder of Carcassonne Twelve years with Virtonomics Belgium soccer ball Traskor Swedish standard Viking helmet
Dalahast Deer horns Ingvar Kamprad Order Mathematic teacher Compass Festive glasses Jubilee Ten Silver Ten
For contribution to the development of Virtonomics The tender collider, VII-XV places The tender collider, VII-XV places The tender collider, VII-XV places The tender collider, IV-VI places The tender collider, IV-VI places World Cuisines, VII-XV places World Cuisines, VII-XV places
World Cuisines, IV-Vi places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places
Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, IV-VI, places
Shagreen, IV-VI, places Shagreen, IV-VI, places Shagreen, IV-VI, places Shagreen, IV-VI, places Shagreen, II-III places Shagreen, II-III places Shagreen, II-III places Shagreen, II-III places
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waerth
Its already difficult enough to get affordable supplies. With that system the price of grain, sugar etc will rise to 309459049273522370404 dollars a piece.

Not necessarily. You would see much more players growing grain, suger, ... So the prices players offer them at would be much lower than what they are now. You would also have a much broader market for these products, with a lot more variation in quality. 
 

10.10.2016, 11:42

Last time edited : 10.10.2016, 11:56
JustNash
Twelve years with Virtonomics Jubilee Ten Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Macedonian common amphora Common amphora of Heraklion The winner in the nomination Your Way to success of the Industry Competition Winner of the Contest for Managers in the nomination "Knowledge is power!"
One year with Virtonomics
Основатель г.Хасселт Jewelry Loupe Founder of Carcassonne Twelve years with Virtonomics Belgium soccer ball Traskor Swedish standard Viking helmet
Dalahast Deer horns Ingvar Kamprad Order Mathematic teacher Compass Festive glasses Jubilee Ten Silver Ten
For contribution to the development of Virtonomics The tender collider, VII-XV places The tender collider, VII-XV places The tender collider, VII-XV places The tender collider, IV-VI places The tender collider, IV-VI places World Cuisines, VII-XV places World Cuisines, VII-XV places
World Cuisines, IV-Vi places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places
Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, IV-VI, places
Shagreen, IV-VI, places Shagreen, IV-VI, places Shagreen, IV-VI, places Shagreen, IV-VI, places Shagreen, II-III places Shagreen, II-III places Shagreen, II-III places Shagreen, II-III places
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Mike1
are you maaaad? Not so
 
Edit:
Just imagine how long a new player would have to play for saving cash to buy a little 5 points mine of every basic type coal, iron, silica, oil. The price of virt would need to be really cheap, which will cannibalise the game's income.
 
PS: my company consumes daily  154 Million grain, 13 M oil, 7 M coal, 7 M iron, 6 M Silica ...

Of course I'm maaaad!! Why else would I still be in this game?!? I roll!
 
Your company also sits on a mountain of cash which you might choose to turn into game points which you might use to buy grain farms, oil wells, coal mines, ... Now you have no use for all that cash. If the independent supplier's price for game points is right, you can make money from investing your cash whilst providing your own resources and more and thus helping the community.
 
Also: we could finally grow our mining qualifications at a reasonable level... 
 

10.10.2016, 15:45
gamerz300
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Mike1
are you maaaad? Not so
 
Edit:
Just imagine how long a new player would have to play for saving cash to buy a little 5 points mine of every basic type coal, iron, silica, oil. The price of virt would need to be really cheap, which will cannibalise the game's income.
Look at my companies name, that should explain everything To you (before you call me mad too)
 
Base price for a 5 point coal mine assuming 0 profit at current independent price (including equipment and wages) 763,131,135 per virt cash point. However I know on lien I can produce coal for at least half that...
 
On Mary it's:
Coal: $5 (biased due to one company but sounds about right, gg)
Iron: $10
Crystal Meth: $2
Silica: $7
Oil: $15 (on par with lien for me when I was producing)
 
Assuming iron is correct and mine purchasing is 66% (too high imo) of the independent suppliers price.
 
2971663×47.999999995
= 142639823.99 or 28,527,964.80 per point. That's something I would expect a 6 month in player to be able to afford. And based on that if I was to invest all my cash into points I'd get 24,000 points...
 
So tell me how is this a bad idea if we use a reasonable baseline of 66% for mine purchasing?
 
However the game has coal set to 7.48 per unit as a asset structure which makes buying it 2.5 more expensive. My only suggestion is maybe setting a cash virt price of 20 million and giving the mines a set number based on the minerals base value. So for coal it's 7.5 for iron it's double etc.
With this setup users with 100 million cash can buy a 5 point q1 mine with 13.3 million units.
Something you can't complain about because IT'S IN THE GAME! Even if you double the cost to $15 per unit tack on the production costs you still can sell coal at 25 a pop and make a little money with tech 1 bq 1 which would help everyone...
 
Tho I should bring up one thing points bought by virt cash could be used to increase qualification but perhaps a ratio of 100:1 or 250:1 with a max of 15 per qualification per virt year or real year? Because let's face it if this idea happens the qualifications will bottleneck everything and everyone...
 
I'll do a full scale mockup in this when I get on my computer in about a hour. I'll create a new post for it with charts price layouts for nearly every paid enterprise. 
 

10.10.2016, 18:54.     Subject: Q
Mike1
Eleven years with Virtonomics
Four years with Virtonomics
Основатель г.Парауапебас Thirteen years With Virtonomics Founder of Badagri Founder of Acharnes Coupe du Monde Russia soccer ball Portugal soccer ball Belgium soccer ball
Croatia soccer ball Argentina soccer ball Brazil soccer ball France soccer ball Swedish profile Ingvar Kamprad Order Biology teacher Biology teacher
Biology teacher Biology teacher History teacher Physics teacher Literature teacher Ladybug Jubilee Ten Bronze Ten
Silver Ten Founder of Peristeri Founder of Osogbo Golden hook V sign V sign V sign Single corporate chevron
Mandarin duck For contribution to the development of Virtonomics Founder of the city Jalingo Founder of the city Lafia The tender collider, VII-XV places The tender collider, VII-XV places The tender collider, IV-VI places The tender collider, IV-VI places
The tender collider, IV-VI places The tender collider, IV-VI places The tender collider, II-III places The tender collider, II-III places The tender collider, II-III places The tender collider, II-III places The tender collider, II-III places The tender collider, II-III places
The tender collider, II-III places The tender collider, II-III places The tender collider, II-III places The tender collider, II-III places The tender collider, the winner The tender collider, the winner The tender collider, the winner The tender collider, the winner
World Cuisines, IV-Vi places World Cuisines, II-III places World Cuisines, II-III places World Cuisines, II-III places World Cuisines, II-III places World Cuisines, II-III places World Cuisines, II-III places World Cuisines, II-III places
World Cuisines, II-III places World Cuisines, II-III places World Cuisines, II-III places World Cuisines, the winner World Cuisines, the winner World Cuisines, the winner World Cuisines, the winner World Cuisines, the winner
World Cuisines, the winner World Cuisines, the winner World Cuisines, the winner World Cuisines, the winner World Cuisines, the winner Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places
Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, IV-VI, places Shagreen, IV-VI, places Shagreen, IV-VI, places Shagreen, IV-VI, places Shagreen, IV-VI, places Shagreen, IV-VI, places
Shagreen, IV-VI, places Shagreen, IV-VI, places Shagreen, IV-VI, places Shagreen, II-III places Shagreen, II-III places Shagreen, II-III places Shagreen, II-III places Shagreen, the winner
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JN, glad you understood the playful way i've put my maaaad.
 
Of course this is a great idea, i just have no clue how this could remain being a business for the game owners?
I'd estimate current top players being able to generate cash to acquire several hundred points during every update. 
 

10.10.2016, 21:41
gamerz300
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because i think it should only be for bq 1 stuff not 2 (farm) or 1.25 (mines)
 
So I said I would create a layout... Before I do wtf is up with the base asset structure for minerals... my coal mine has 1.3million resources 97 million (I made a calculation error on my phone), this means each unit is worth $73 ea plus everything... Liens independent supplier is only 12, this means anything less than $80 you're loosing money... Which questions any property value from points purchases... copy/paste from mary much?
 
Now that is out... im going to based on half the value of the independent supplier because clearly nothing can be trusted but what we could pay for in game... for the mines w/o suppliers I used minerals value under the asset structure divide by 2, divided again by the amount of resources I have left.
 
Plantations and Farms are swapped in productions by accident.
http://s000.tinyupload.com/index.php?file_id=14962487808404085582 ...
 
Based on the chart above using a 20 million point base someone like Mike1 would need (bq1, tech1):
602 grain farms of the highest amount costing about 4.2T
357 10 point oil mines or 71.4 billion /year
78 10 point coal/iron/silica mines 15.3 billion (each) /year
or about 4.4 trillion first year and running costs, 117.3 billion a year plus running expenses...
 
sure it's lien but simple math for all other realms using those farm/mine numbers.
 
Tho I have to say many things are out of wack...
 
Users using virt money to buy points in this way they can only get base quality 1 units, and no % bonus beyond the 10 points (might show it in chart, if it did sorry), and real money bought points get a 15% production bonus in quality. 
 

11.10.2016, 15:27

Last time edited : 11.10.2016, 16:16
JustNash
Twelve years with Virtonomics Jubilee Ten Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Macedonian common amphora Common amphora of Heraklion The winner in the nomination Your Way to success of the Industry Competition Winner of the Contest for Managers in the nomination "Knowledge is power!"
One year with Virtonomics
Основатель г.Хасселт Jewelry Loupe Founder of Carcassonne Twelve years with Virtonomics Belgium soccer ball Traskor Swedish standard Viking helmet
Dalahast Deer horns Ingvar Kamprad Order Mathematic teacher Compass Festive glasses Jubilee Ten Silver Ten
For contribution to the development of Virtonomics The tender collider, VII-XV places The tender collider, VII-XV places The tender collider, VII-XV places The tender collider, IV-VI places The tender collider, IV-VI places World Cuisines, VII-XV places World Cuisines, VII-XV places
World Cuisines, IV-Vi places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places
Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, IV-VI, places
Shagreen, IV-VI, places Shagreen, IV-VI, places Shagreen, IV-VI, places Shagreen, IV-VI, places Shagreen, II-III places Shagreen, II-III places Shagreen, II-III places Shagreen, II-III places
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indeed, something should then be done about buying qualification increases. If not, the game would explode.
 
So: qualification can only be increased with VIRTs. You should be able to buy VIRT with real money again.
 
The independent supplier supplies game points, not VIRTs.
 
Special deals should be paid for in VIRT, not game points.
 

Then again: what remains is, is actually saying: mines, farms, ... are now also available for virto-$ and not (just) points anymore. Lifting a frustration many players have, but creating new issues with players that paid heavily for these assets and indeed creating income issues for the game's administrators... 
 

List of forums -> Your suggestions and bug reports-> suggestion: remove all independent suppliers...

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