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List of forums -> Main forum of the online business game "Virtonomics" -> Are you happy with your ROI?

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Topic created : 5.05.2020, 18:32
Wonson
Seven years with Virtonomics
Jubilee Ten Bronze Ten Bronze Ten For contribution to the development of Virtonomics The tender collider, IV-VI places The tender collider, II-III places The tender collider, II-III places World Cuisines, IV-Vi places
World Cuisines, IV-Vi places World Cuisines, IV-Vi places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, IV-VI, places Shagreen, II-III places Eight years with Virtonomics
The winner of the Industry Competition Winner of the Leaders Contest in the nomination Tender mania
Four years with Virtonomics
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Wondime
m:
Wondime
 
Hello Mary Folks,
 
Today I was calculating if it's worth to reopen my chocolate factory, running on Tech-22. I need equipment Q:37.80 for that. That is if I mix my cheap equipment (Q:30.80) made out of free resources with a higher quality equipment on the market I will get the equipment quality I need at the cost of $680,000/equipment.
 
With this not-so cheap equipment, I will get an ROI=743 updates. Things will improve if I install Extended Warranty booster and that gives me ROI=430 updates. I intend to sell the chocolate at $19.00 at my factory not the dirt cheap CTIE pricing. With CTIE pricing policy($8.00), ROI will be exactly 6500 updates, which means I can recover costs of equipment I bought at the beginning of year 2038, if nothing bad happens.
 
I want to know if you folks really take this kind of deals? ROI of my factories used to be 2-30 updates. Now 430 updates at best. Are you happy with your ROI? and what is an acceptable ROI?
 
Disclaimer: I just wanted to discuss my problem and get a feedback from other players who buy equipment on Mary realm. This is not intended to instigate or intimidate sellers. Just discussion. Ridiculously
   

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5.05.2020, 20:10
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1. I repair my equipment no more than 1 time per year. To do this, just use the additional villa.
2. You have chosen a very unprofitable product. Therefore, such a low payback.
3. Unprofitable products are best produced on machines from free resources with a cost price of 8,000 virtual dollars. The quality is slightly reduced. And the cost is significantly lower. 
 

5.05.2020, 21:39
TheLoki
Nine years with Virtonomics
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E-Corp
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Loki Industries
 
Wonson
Hello Mary Folks,
 
Today I was calculating if it's worth to reopen my chocolate factory, running on Tech-22. I need equipment Q:37.80 for that. That is if I mix my cheap equipment (Q:30.80) made out of free resources with a higher quality equipment on the market I will get the equipment quality I need at the cost of $680,000/equipment.
 
With this not-so cheap equipment, I will get an ROI=743 updates. Things will improve if I install Extended Warranty booster and that gives me ROI=430 updates. I intend to sell the chocolate at $19.00 at my factory not the dirt cheap CTIE pricing. With CTIE pricing policy($8.00), ROI will be exactly 6500 updates, which means I can recover costs of equipment I bought at the beginning of year 2038, if nothing bad happens.
 
I want to know if you folks really take this kind of deals? ROI of my factories used to be 2-30 updates. Now 430 updates at best. Are you happy with your ROI? and what is an acceptable ROI?
 
Disclaimer: I just wanted to discuss my problem and get a feedback from other players who buy equipment on Mary realm. This is not intended to instigate or intimidate sellers. Just discussion. Ridiculously

Hey!
 
Long time ago, 3-4 years ago, there was a machine paradise, you could get Q40 for 40k, Similar to the situation on Lien. But, over the years, inflation did its own, and people just stopped buying real resources i guess,and stopped sharing,  so it was always less and less and prices way too high.
 
I tried to appeal many times to this problem, but no one seemed to care.
 
Now we are witnessing the record high prices of machines, that are supposed to be for available for everyone, so people can get high quality goods, and not spend so much money on machines, that they won't ever get back. I mean, really, cheapest Q40+ is 1.2 mil, going up to 6mil for one machine. Made from Steel and Electronic components. The machines are also the base of any industrial company. Killing this market, is killing the quality of the goods in general on Mary realm.
 
Anyhow, there are 3 things you can do.
 
1. Buy it and produce something that is more profitable, (which is still difficult, since most of the high price stuff, require premium materials- you have to buy). (Would never recommend, you would therefore, not only almost never get the money back, but also support this kind of 'free market'.
 
2. Buy the tech 19, which you have machines that i produced only for sole purpose of putting the price down. 60k .When i started selling my Q31-32 machines, the market price for the Q32 machines was about 400k. Since then we have a huge gap between Q30ish , and anything above. You can produce still a decent quality with Tech 19.
 
3. Spend real cash, buy mines, or buy quality upgrade on your factory, and produce high Q machines yourself.
 

Again, this won't change, nor anyone will stand on your side, since most of the biggest companies, produce machines themselves, with purchased resources, and they couldn't care less if someone else has it or not. If you need more equipment or special orders, you can always contact me and ask, if necessary i will sell you for cheaper my Q32 machines.
 
Good luck!
Loki 
 

6.05.2020, 06:05
Wonson
Seven years with Virtonomics
Jubilee Ten Bronze Ten Bronze Ten For contribution to the development of Virtonomics The tender collider, IV-VI places The tender collider, II-III places The tender collider, II-III places World Cuisines, IV-Vi places
World Cuisines, IV-Vi places World Cuisines, IV-Vi places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, IV-VI, places Shagreen, II-III places Eight years with Virtonomics
The winner of the Industry Competition Winner of the Leaders Contest in the nomination Tender mania
Four years with Virtonomics
l:
Wondime
m:
Wondime
 
SchmatkoA and TheLoki,
Thanks for your replies. I appreciate that you read my words and spent time to reply, and what you say makes sense.
I'm not here to change things. I just want to know if other players take a business with ROI=400 updates, or maybe 200 updates? Or is it me hesitating too much. Maybe I should install lower Tech for lower businesses like Sweet production as SchmatkoA said. I will consider all the things you two gentlemen said. Also waiting for more replies. 
 

6.05.2020, 17:14
ChrisTekk
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Hey there! Interesting topic to discuss Well
 
Just a few thoughts:
* there is in-efficient markets, i.e. low trade activities (supply, or demand); this also seems the case for some of (high quality) machinery / investment goods (as noted), which usually depend on paid resources
* the bad thing about paid resources: you got to "pay to play"
* the nice thing about paid resources: the key to opening high-profit markets sits readily available in your pocket ;) - your own judgement ("investment decisions")
 

For myself, 200-300 turns to break-even seems like a crazy risk to take. I would never do that. But the judgement is with the intentions and perspective of the investor ;)
 
In the real economy, it's the capital markets that provide a means for testing your investment case: risk vs return opportunities. The following would be a cool way to go and test your investment case (yet not really easy in Virtonomics):
+ found a separate Virtonomics company ("legal entity" - encapsulating the business risk)
+ formulate your investment case similar to above - yet way more focused on the risk (i.e. market / sourcing / selling assumptions)
+ put this in your "emissions note" for financing (bonds) - and campaign to raise money for your case
 

Cheers, Chris 
 

7.05.2020, 11:38

Last time edited : 7.05.2020, 12:51
JustNash
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investment yields are extremely low across the realm. This is normal: cash is abundantly available. If you have say $10Tn in the bank, then it's still better to invest at a 0.0001% yield than at 0%.
 
Looking at the required time to earn back your investments. That's just the inverse ratio, of course. Have a look at the auctions of sawmills, farms, ... If you can buy something that will pay your investment back in 1000 days (or less), let me know, I'll instantly buy it :-)
 
Apart from that: of course there are always products that will allow you to make higher profits than others. If that's what you're after, do research and negotiate with those that are crucial to your business idea. (not me, I don't do individual deals :-D)
 
[Thanks for starting the thread, Wonson, I'll have to look into the impact of the equipment repair cost on my clothing business. It could very well be that these have become unprofitable... Even though I might be satisfied with 0.0001% yields, I don't want negative yields :-)]
 
[EDIT: omg: the cost of my football uniforms has gone up by 50% due to equipment repairs alone] 
 

7.05.2020, 14:10

Last time edited : 7.05.2020, 14:12
Wonson
Seven years with Virtonomics
Jubilee Ten Bronze Ten Bronze Ten For contribution to the development of Virtonomics The tender collider, IV-VI places The tender collider, II-III places The tender collider, II-III places World Cuisines, IV-Vi places
World Cuisines, IV-Vi places World Cuisines, IV-Vi places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, VII-XV places Shagreen, IV-VI, places Shagreen, II-III places Eight years with Virtonomics
The winner of the Industry Competition Winner of the Leaders Contest in the nomination Tender mania
Four years with Virtonomics
l:
Wondime
m:
Wondime
 
ChrisTekk and JustNash,
I appreciate that you spent time to read my post and leave a reply.
 
Christekk
The following would be a cool way to go and test your investment case (yet not really easy in Virtonomics):
+found a separate Virtonomics company ("legal entity" - encapsulating the business risk)
With inflating markets, risks are automatically mitigated for bumpkin businessmen, like me. Devs are too kind. Very we!
 
Justnash
[EDIT: omg: the cost of my football uniforms has gone up by 50% due to equipment repairs alone]
Yes, exactly. A few days ago I evaluated all the "Clothes and Shoes" category, in reply to a friend's request, and noticed manufacturing Bags and Football Uniform have become high-risk businesses now. Outerwear(sheepskin) also high-risk.
 
Edit: not sure if i should call it high-risk or low-profit. probably the latter is correct. 
 

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